What's inappropriate?

[Guardian7347]

Cap asked for my opinion on something in another thread, and instead of derailing the thread further, a fault I'm already guilty of, I opted to respond here, especially as this is a topic near and dear to me.

Geez maybe Guardian can speak to this as he is a person who actually is/has been on the job of ensuring that we have the freedom .........but what the hell happened to free speech, debating, giving people a hard time, laughing at oneself, laughing with people not at people, the right to be heard, the right to say what you believe/want to say?.................

I can only speak from what has historically been the standard here, and what I've come to understand of the webmasters intent, along with my own personal opinion.

Rant and rave has always been a very open forum for talking, flirting, debating and even arguing openly and without restrictive limitations on thought or speech. It is a place where one can almost purely exercise their right to free speech, even if it is offensive or considered inappropriate by others. Bear in mind, if you choose to exercise your right to be an asshole, others may exercise their right to call you out on the carpet for it. The only real rule that has ever been self-imposed here is no graphic inuendo or blatant sex talk. There is an adult forum for discussing things of a sexual nature, and pm's are always available if needed. If you hint around at things of a sexual nature, fine. Just keep it R rated, and not NC-17. There are minors on here, and it's like in real life, nobody really wants to see that in public. The only other "rule" has been don't be an asshole without "some" provocation. Now, everyone has a rough day, misinterpretes something someone says, or gets heated over a topic that is important to them in some way, and that's acceptable. It happens. What isn't tolerated well is insults and hateful behavior done out of spite. Being an asshole(or bitch) simply to spread hurtful comments or wreck someone else's day is not ok. Malek was a prime example of this, and he was eventually banned, but it was a slow process. Currently, Parousia is our worst offender, but he's no Malek. In-between nasty hate-filled barbs, he can actually carry on conversations and contribute meaningfully to the site. Does he piss me off sometimes? Yes. Do I get over it? Sure do. Would I like to see him ease up on the worst of his behavior? Absolutely. Is he obligated to do so? No. If he isn't careful though, he could find himself suffering the same fate as Malek, and as odd as it may sound, I think that would be a loss.

As stated earlier, this is simply observation and personal opinion; not to be mistaken for an attempt to set any rules. Overall, just use common courtesy in your speech and you can say whatever it is your little heart desires, and you'll be well-received here.

[parousia]

i've broken no rules that you haven't, and i don't appreciate you even mentioning my name in the same context as you've spoken to that of maleks'.

[Chelsea Lynn]

The only real rule that has ever been self-imposed here is no graphic inuendo or blatant sex talk. There is an adult forum for discussing things of a sexual nature, and pm's are always available if needed. If you hint around at things of a sexual nature, fine. Just keep it R rated, and not NC-17.

So I guess me and Seale's ass smoothies are inappripriate? Oops!

[cap1015]

Cap asked for my opinion on something in another thread, and instead of derailing the thread further, a fault I'm already guilty of, I opted to respond here, especially as this is a topic near and dear to me.

Geez maybe Guardian can speak to this as he is a person who actually is/has been on the job of ensuring that we have the freedom .........but what the hell happened to free speech, debating, giving people a hard time, laughing at oneself, laughing with people not at people, the right to be heard, the right to say what you believe/want to say?.................

I can only speak from what has historically been the standard here, and what I've come to understand of the webmasters intent, along with my own personal opinion.

Rant and rave has always been a very open forum for talking, flirting, debating and even arguing openly and without restrictive limitations on thought or speech. It is a place where one can almost purely exercise their right to free speech, even if it is offensive or considered inappropriate by others. Bear in mind, if you choose to exercise your right to be an asshole, others may exercise their right to call you out on the carpet for it. The only real rule that has ever been self-imposed here is no graphic inuendo or blatant sex talk. There is an adult forum for discussing things of a sexual nature, and pm's are always available if needed. If you hint around at things of a sexual nature, fine. Just keep it R rated, and not NC-17. There are minors on here, and it's like in real life, nobody really wants to see that in public. The only other "rule" has been don't be an asshole without "some" provocation. Now, everyone has a rough day, misinterpretes something someone says, or gets heated over a topic that is important to them in some way, and that's acceptable. It happens. What isn't tolerated well is insults and hateful behavior done out of spite. Being an asshole(or bitch) simply to spread hurtful comments or wreck someone else's day is not ok. Malek was a prime example of this, and he was eventually banned, but it was a slow process. Currently, Parousia is our worst offender, but he's no Malek. In-between nasty hate-filled barbs, he can actually carry on conversations and contribute meaningfully to the site. Does he piss me off sometimes? Yes. Do I get over it? Sure do. Would I like to see him ease up on the worst of his behavior? Absolutely. Is he obligated to do so? No. If he isn't careful though, he could find himself suffering the same fate as Malek, and as odd as it may sound, I think that would be a loss.

As stated earlier, this is simply observation and personal opinion; not to be mistaken for an attempt to set any rules. Overall, just use common courtesy in your speech and you can say whatever it is your little heart desires, and you'll be well-received here.

Thanks for the reply and post. I used you as example as a person who is employed and dedicated to the ensurance of Freedom, you should have a forum.

My whole point, which was missed time and again, was that by the comments such as “we will get you banned for what we are saying is inappropriate” is in of itself a form of censorship, if in fact there is no specific guidelines and/or laws of “appropriate” posting behavior.
I honestly find 14 years old girls talking about sleeping with friends older brothers, giving BJ’s, HJ’s, and similar conversations posted throughout the Rant and Rave and Relationship Advice forums as being something I don’t like to see or read. BUT so far no one else has seen this as inappropriate and I for one believe as long as it is not obvious that someone is using the forum as a means of enticing someone into to doing something illegal, I choose either to ignore or make a contradicting statement.
My other point was that I was making fun of myself, and the thread in a light hearted, make fun of CAP way and used the word “porn star”…………….Was told it’s not funny ( Ok I understand) and that it was inappropriate and in a follow post that it was borderline illegal. Now this is where I was confused because in the same post I see the words; dumbfuck, cock and several other words of profanity. So I just didn’t understand who got to pick that “porn star” is innapropriate but dumbfuck and cock is not.
I also was trying to show that once you go down the slippery slope of being the “judge” (especially if it is a mob mentality), there is a tremendous amount of diligence and responsibility to assume.
I also wanted to convey that unless it can be shown that an adult person is engaging in solicitation and/or sharing of pornographic materials with a minor, there is nothing illegal about posting things that might be distasteful to others.
Finally, and then I’m done with this, because it appears very few care about this subject (I understand) and other than a very few, most don’t understand what I’m trying to say. But my last point is, yes I understand there are young people on this site, but this site, nor its participants can and never should substitute for the role of the child’s parents. At times it offends me that there are 13-14-15-16 year olds on this site (due to the content of some forums), but in my research I see that there is little anyone can do to resolve other than trust those young people will learn and not be harmed by the postings, just like magazines, books, movies, music, and other venues directed at and for adults.

[JeremyM]

i've broken no rules that you haven't, and i don't appreciate you even mentioning my name in the same context as you've spoken to that of maleks'.

Technically you did break rules.

As for his comparison of you and malek, both start unnecessary crap with women and kids on the website, stalk pictures, stalk posters, discussed hacking.

Both crave attention at all costs and don't know when enough is enough and both are over the age of 30 and have multi accounts.

So no wonder Guardian thought to compare you to malek.

[parousia]

you obviously have some weird sexually attraction towards me, jeremy. seriously man, it's creeping me out

[Guardian7347]

The only real rule that has ever been self-imposed here is no graphic inuendo or blatant sex talk. There is an adult forum for discussing things of a sexual nature, and pm's are always available if needed. If you hint around at things of a sexual nature, fine. Just keep it R rated, and not NC-17.

So I guess me and Seale's ass smoothies are inappripriate? Oops!

lol Not at all darling. Ass smoothies as a reference are perfectly ok. You can talk about tea-bagging someone. Really, the only thing you can't do is to go into lurid detail about something sexual.

[SmileAreSexy]

I honestly find 14 years old girls talking about sleeping with friends older brothers, giving BJ’s, HJ’s, and similar conversations posted throughout the Rant and Rave and Relationship Advice forums as being something I don’t like to see or read.

I really hope you don't think it stops there. Never experienced myself, but I hear it every day coming from the mouths of kids barely in puberty. Some things I don't want to repeat. Seriously, don't think the word "sex" is going to have my mother marching to the webmaster.

I don't think that being rude is so terrible that it should get you banned, but.. sometimes I hate how people can be mean and just live with it. You don't know what that person has to deal with every day and its not like it wont kill you to restrain yourself from that one rude witty retort.

Yeah.. I've said things. I've said things Dorn, Parousia, Guardian, and if I miss anyone and I'm sure there are, I'm sorry. Even if I thought those people deserved it, I still regret saying anything anyway. That's the problem with this site no one ever listens to me about. There are too many users on here that think being rude is ok as long as the shits not being thrown their way. Ive had my feelings hurt multiple times on here. It has even gotten as far as Xwikki which i wasn't prepared for. This is why I might leave. Okay, its not a reason but its pushing me a little bit more everyday. I have another reason for leaving thats way more of a reason but I'd rather not get into right now.

[Guardian7347]

I honestly find 14 years old girls talking about sleeping with friends older brothers, giving BJ’s, HJ’s, and similar conversations posted throughout the Rant and Rave and Relationship Advice forums as being something I don’t like to see or read.

I really hope you don't think it stops there. Never experienced myself, but I hear it every day coming from the mouths of kids barely in puberty. Some things I don't want to repeat. Seriously, don't think the word "sex" is going to have my mother marching to the webmaster.

I don't think that being rude is so terrible that it should get you banned, but.. sometimes I hate how people can be mean and just live with it. You don't know what that person has to deal with every day and its not like it wont kill you to restrain yourself from that one rude witty retort.

Yeah.. I've said things. I've said things Dorn, Parousia, Guardian, and if I miss anyone and I'm sure there are, I'm sorry. Even if I thought those people deserved it, I still regret saying anything anyway. That's the problem with this site no one ever listens to me about. There are too many users on here that think being rude is ok as long as the shits not being thrown their way. Ive had my feelings hurt multiple times on here. It has even gotten as far as Xwikki which i wasn't prepared for. This is why I might leave. Okay, its not a reason but its pushing me a little bit more everyday. I have another reason for leaving thats way more of a reason but I'd rather not get into right now.

I agree with you. Being rude, by itself, isn't a bannable offense IMO. It's when you establish a consistent pattern of verbal assault without provocation that we have to begin to wonder if we, as a group, are willing to tolerate the abuse. Like you, I've said rude things to people on here probably more times than I can count over the years. Usually in the heat of the moment during a debate. Many of them I regret, not all. Drew Terry and Heartsdreamer are two I don't regret. If I ever hurt your feelings, I apologize now. For my end, don't worry. I've taken nothing personal that you've said to me, nor do I remember any of it.

i've broken no rules that you haven't, and i don't appreciate you even mentioning my name in the same context as you've spoken to that of maleks'.

Technically you did break rules.

As for his comparison of you and malek, both start unnecessary crap with women and kids on the website, stalk pictures, stalk posters, discussed hacking.

Both crave attention at all costs and don't know when enough is enough and both are over the age of 30 and have multi accounts.

So no wonder Guardian thought to compare you to malek.

Parousia, You're a lot like Malek. The biggest difference is you ARE smarter than him, and you're not AS aggressive as him in your hate behavior. If you take offense to the comparison, you have the ability to change that.

[Chelsea Lynn]

The only real rule that has ever been self-imposed here is no graphic inuendo or blatant sex talk. There is an adult forum for discussing things of a sexual nature, and pm's are always available if needed. If you hint around at things of a sexual nature, fine. Just keep it R rated, and not NC-17.

So I guess me and Seale's ass smoothies are inappripriate? Oops!

lol Not at all darling. Ass smoothies as a reference are perfectly ok. You can talk about tea-bagging someone. Really, the only thing you can't do is to go into lurid detail about something sexual.

SEEEAALLE, we can talk about ass smoothies all we want!

[parousia]

Parousia, You're a lot like Malek. The biggest difference is you *ARE smarter than him, and you're not AS aggressive as him in your hate behavior. If you take offense to the comparison, you have the ability to change that.

then you don't even read my post, because that character and i are nothing alike.
i don't follow people around and make strange sexual advances towards them, i simply wait for idiots like you to approach me and then point out their faults.
i've been here a long time and have yet to venture into the sex forums, i'd tell you why but what difference does it make when you're too busy playing hero to listen in the first place. it's all good man, every forum needs a hero, and i guess that's you.

* that doesn't work on me, faggot

verbal assault without provocation

[cap1015]

I agree with you. Being rude, by itself, isn't a bannable offense IMO. It's when you establish a consistent pattern of verbal assault without provocation that we have to begin to wonder if we, as a group, are willing to tolerate the abuse. Like you, I've said rude things to people on here probably more times than I can count over the years. Usually in the heat of the moment during a debate. Many of them I regret, not all. Drew Terry and Heartsdreamer are two I don't regret. If I ever hurt your feelings, I apologize now. For my end, don't worry. I've taken nothing personal that you've said to me, nor do I remember any of it.

Guardian, as a paid soldier, someone who is dedicated and sworn to defend this country and it's freedoms, you of all people should understand that freedom is for everyone, not just the ones we like, or agree with. THAT IS THE POINT I KEEP TRYING TO MAKE. If we as a group or as individuals don't like the "abuse" of others on this site, we can do the following: 1. Disagree/fight back/debate 2. leave 3. Ignore 4. Try to change/encourage 5. Report to the mods/authorities. BUT UNLESS THE ABUSE IS ILLEGAL WE CANNOT CENSOR OR BAN THEM BECAUSE WE DON"T LIKE THEM OR THEIR STATEMENTS..........you know why? BECAUSE SOMEDAY AND MAYBE SOMEDAY SOON SOME GROUP MAY NOT LIKE YOU! Again unless someone is breaking established rules and/or laws you can't harm them just because you don't like what they say, how they look, what they think.

I freakin give up, no one sees the bigger picture that freedom should not be and is not prejudiced, and as much as I find some people, their ideas/their statements and their actions as completely wrong, I can't and don't want to take that right from them to be that way AS LONG AS aren't breaking any laws/rules............saying things people don't like to hear, whether provoked or not is not illegal or against the rules. Unsocialble, rude, distasteful or unfriendly...........maybe but not my or your right to say "you can't do that, the group doesn't like it"


Dayum I really would rather be telling jokes!...........

[Guardian7347]

then you don't even read my post, because that character and i are nothing alike.
i don't follow people around and make strange sexual advances towards them

Yes...you do. Wait, you don't really make strange sexual advances towards them, you just pic stalk them. That's the only real difference between you and him. Are you so blind in your behavior that you can't see the similarities? It's almost as if you seen his behavior and thought it was so awesome you are now copy-catting Malek. Was he your douche-bag idol? There IS one other difference between the two of you. He would only be an asshole to women. You seem unable to control yourself at all. I've read a great many of your posts, and the re-occurring theme I've seen is simple. Unguided anger lashed out at people on an entirely random basis. Cowardly PMs sent out to people with a block on to prevent them from sending one back at you. Your explanation that people aren't real if they aren't standing right in front of you. The fact that you lash out with name calling at other people when you yourself are extremely vulnerable to ridicule. You're disturbing obsession with the sexual orientation of other men on this site. I'm beginning to think you and Jon may have more in common than you're letting on.

[Guardian7347]

I agree with you. Being rude, by itself, isn't a bannable offense IMO. It's when you establish a consistent pattern of verbal assault without provocation that we have to begin to wonder if we, as a group, are willing to tolerate the abuse. Like you, I've said rude things to people on here probably more times than I can count over the years. Usually in the heat of the moment during a debate. Many of them I regret, not all. Drew Terry and Heartsdreamer are two I don't regret. If I ever hurt your feelings, I apologize now. For my end, don't worry. I've taken nothing personal that you've said to me, nor do I remember any of it.

Guardian, as a paid soldier, someone who is dedicated and sworn to defend this country and it's freedoms, you of all people should understand that freedom is for everyone, not just the ones we like, or agree with. THAT IS THE POINT I KEEP TRYING TO MAKE. If we as a group or as individuals don't like the "abuse" of others on this site, we can do the following: 1. Disagree/fight back/debate 2. leave 3. Ignore 4. Try to change/encourage 5. Report to the mods/authorities. BUT UNLESS THE ABUSE IS ILLEGAL WE CANNOT CENSOR OR BAN THEM BECAUSE WE DON"T LIKE THEM OR THEIR STATEMENTS..........you know why? BECAUSE SOMEDAY AND MAYBE SOMEDAY SOON SOME GROUP MAY NOT LIKE YOU! Again unless someone is breaking established rules and/or laws you can't harm them just because you don't like what they say, how they look, what they think.

I freakin give up, no one sees the bigger picture that freedom should not be and is not prejudiced, and as much as I find some people, their ideas/their statements and their actions as completely wrong, I can't and don't want to take that right from them to be that way AS LONG AS aren't breaking any laws/rules............saying things people don't like to hear, whether provoked or not is not illegal or against the rules. Unsocialble, rude, distasteful or unfriendly...........maybe but not my or your right to say "you can't do that, the group doesn't like it"


Dayum I really would rather be telling jokes!...........

I DO agree with you Cap. Everyone is entitled by Providence to free speech. Humans have an inalienable right to express their opinion and voice their views. They are entitled to discuss and debate any topic they so choose, and to disagree with any authority they feel so inclined to disagree with. What they aren't entitled to is the right to abuse by verbal assault. That is something that would have resulted in a duel during the time of our founding fathers. If you insulted someone, you were going to fight to the death. someone had to die for that kind of behavior. No one is required to "just deal with it".

It's not a matter of banning because we don't like someone's statements. There are plenty of people that I disagree with who I would never consider banning. Drew Terry for one. I strongly disagree with that man almost every time I read his posts. I've gotten in countless debates turned arguments with him over the years. While I personally think the man isn't firing on all cylinders, I would never consider having him banned. He's not abusive in his speech. He's just...waaaaaaaaay out there. I won't go into religion anymore because of him, because I'll get sucked into an argument with him. The banning is a last resort when someone's behavior is abusive to others. No one has the right to abuse others under any circumstances, and unprovoked verbal assaults are just that, abuse. If we as a group don't like the abuse of another, we have the right to remove them from our presence. That's exactly what our founding fathers did.

The freedom of speech isn't without constraints. Wikipedia says this: "In the United States freedom of expression is protected by the First Amendment to the United States Constitution. There are several statutory and common law exceptions including obscenity, defamation, incitement, incitement to riot or imminent lawless action, fighting words, making false statements in "matters within the jurisdiction" of the federal government, information decreed to be related to national security such as classified information, false advertising, perjury, harassment, privileged communications, trade secrets, copyright, patents, military conduct, and time, place and manner restrictions." Some of Parousia's behavior, the offensive part, falls under several of those catagories, including, but not limited to, defamation, slander, fighting words and harassment. How do you defend this behavior? Because you find it humorous? Not everyone finds him humorous. Some people are offended and hurt by his behavior, automatically nullifying the protected status of his speech. By his continuation of this behavior, he opens himself up to any negative actions against him by his own choice.
By all means man, joke away! We could use it.

[parousia]

Yes...you do. Wait, you don't really make strange sexual advances towards them, you just pic stalk them.

nos is the only person i've repeatedly asked for a photo, but it has nothing to do with an actual photo. duck face is the only avatar i poke fun at.
you didn't think this through, did you?

Cowardly PMs sent out to people with a block on to prevent them from sending one back at you.

throwing a tomato is indeed a cowardly act.

You're disturbing obsession with the sexual orientation of other men on this site

then stop taking it up the ass, bucko

I'm beginning to think you and Jon may have more in common than you're letting on.

i don't understand what this means, PLEASE explain it to me, jon and the rest of dm?

you're doing this to yourself man

[cap1015]

I DO agree with you Cap. Everyone is entitled by Providence to free speech. Humans have an inalienable right to express their opinion and voice their views. They are entitled to discuss and debate any topic they so choose, and to disagree with any authority they feel so inclined to disagree with. What they aren't entitled to is the right to abuse by verbal assault. That is something that would have resulted in a duel during the time of our founding fathers. If you insulted someone, you were going to fight to the death. someone had to die for that kind of behavior. No one is required to "just deal with it".

You're putting words into my post, I never said "just deal with it", however a duel would be dealing with it. What I said and continue to say is there are a myriad of remedies, that in our time is akin to a duel, such as verbal debate, reporting to authorities, legal action and the one thing no one seems to get,... this site is not a required site to visit, no one makes me or anyone else come here and read anyone posts. There is a foe button and what is it they say about arguing or fighting a crazy person.......you can't win........because the crazy person will never understand your point and those from a distance won't be able to tell the two of you apart. And lastly on this subject please define for me the legal defition of verbal assault.........because again I'm not defending any particular person but is saying "porn star" an assault? Is saying someone is a loon an assualt, what about motherfucker? Honky? Redneck?.......see my point? who determines the assualt in your example. My point again being we can duel or we can ignore or we can turn them over to the relevant authorities.........but you or I or anyone else don't get to decide on our own, or in our little group what is acceptable without assuming some major responsibilities.

It's not a matter of banning because we don't like someone's statements. There are plenty of people that I disagree with who I would never consider banning. Drew Terry for one. I strongly disagree with that man almost every time I read his posts. I've gotten in countless debates turned arguments with him over the years. While I personally think the man isn't firing on all cylinders, I would never consider having him banned. He's not abusive in his speech. He's just...waaaaaaaaay out there. I won't go into religion anymore because of him, because I'll get sucked into an argument with him. The banning is a last resort when someone's behavior is abusive to others. No one has the right to abuse others under any circumstances, and unprovoked verbal assaults are just that, abuse. If we as a group don't like the abuse of another, we have the right to remove them from our presence. That's exactly what our founding fathers did.

And I agree, but they didn't just remove people without a process and some form of agreement/standards of what would be acceptable.

Some of Parousia's behavior, the offensive part, falls under several of those catagories, including, but not limited to, defamation, slander, fighting words and harassment. How do you defend this behavior? Because you find it humorous? Not everyone finds him humorous. Some people are offended and hurt by his behavior, automatically nullifying the protected status of his speech. By his continuation of this behavior, he opens himself up to any negative actions against him by his own choice.
By all means man, joke away! We could use it.

I am not and have not specifically defended Parousia, he has never needed me or anyone else to defend him, I do at times find his posts thought provoking, extremely ironical, and at times funny ( like his high horse picture/reference). I have also found some to be rude, not of good taste, and inflammatory, I have had my verbal jousts with him in the past as well. I have been and continue to support and say that we have to be able to think for ourselves, defend ourselves and be strong in the face of adversity, if not, as you well know when we stop, we become much like those ruled by groups like the Taliban and no longer get the freedoms we enjoy now and they not us, will determine what is appropriate through a system we won't like much.

So please understand I'm not picking a side of personal argument or which poster should be banned, I'm trying to get people to realize to think for themslelves adn to understand the consequences of their actions and words.

It seem's the jokes on me..........again, LOL

[parousia]

tell you what i'll do guard: i'm bout to make a poll and ask dm if they want me to leave or not. tomorrow morning, before my walk i'll check the results. if there are more votes for yes, then i will peacefully bow out. if there are more votes for yes, then you put me on foe and let's be done of this, because i'm not changing for you or anyone else, asshole.

my word as a gentleman, i will abide

[Guardian7347]

tell you what i'll do guard: i'm bout to make a poll and ask dm if they want me to leave or not. tomorrow morning, before my walk i'll check the results. if there are more votes for yes, then i will peacefully bow out. if there are more votes for yes, then you put me on foe and let's be done of this, because i'm not changing for you or anyone else, asshole.

my word as a gentleman, i will abide

I don't want it like that green. I just want you to not be a raging asshole who goes around insulting people because the urge strikes you. Some can take it, but there's no reason to HAVE to. I just want you to chill on the nastier behavior. If you can do that, I'm cool with you. If not, that sucks, but I'll vote for you to be gone. Just tell me you'll ease up on the worst of green behavior and I'll vote no myself.

[Guardian7347]

You're putting words into my post, I never said "just deal with it",

You did. I'm just stripping the veneer from your words. You said to foe him (just pretend he isn't there, still harassing people), report to the authorities-webby and EM(and we know what their action won't be, so again, no action), or let myself be driven out of someplace I love and have frequented for over eight years(again, does nothing about the problem in the first place). These options don't fix the problem of the abusive behavior in the first place.
As you are well aware, there is no clear-cut definition of verbal assault. But there is a bar that needs to be met. Intent to cause harm, which is measurable. Name-calling, degrading comments, slander, insults, and highlighting the flaws of another for the sake of lowering their self-confidence are all forms of verbal assault.

but you or I or anyone else don't get to decide on our own, or in our little group what is acceptable without assuming some major responsibilities.

Yes we do. Welcome to "The Great Experiment" that is America! We, the people, have the power to decide, as a group, what we decide to define as acceptable.

And I agree, but they didn't just remove people without a process and some form of agreement/standards of what would be acceptable.

The founding fathers broke from Englands rule after a long period of seeking redress from the King of England for offenses against their natural rights. In much the same way, those of DM have sought redress of their grievances with those who they have grievance time and again without success.Every society, every gathering of people, by default establish, either spoken or unspoken, some form of standards and code of conduct. DM has always had such a standard as well. When someone flagrantly disregards the standard of acceptable behavior time and again, willfully ignoring any attempt to bring about reconciliation, what choice do the people have but to remove that person?

I am not and have not specifically defended Parousia, he has never needed me or anyone else to defend him, I do at times find his posts thought provoking, extremely ironical, and at times funny ( like his high horse picture/reference). I have also found some to be rude, not of good taste, and inflammatory, I have had my verbal jousts with him in the past as well.

Believe it or not, I understand where you're coming from, and even appreciate your imput. I don't necessarily want P banned either, he CAN be, as you said, thought-provoking, ironic, and funny. The problem is a murderer can be a good friend to someone. If he ditched the worst behavior, few here would have issue with him. He openly refuses to do that though.

I have been and continue to support and say that we have to be able to think for ourselves, defend ourselves and be strong in the face of adversity, if not, as you well know when we stop, we become much like those ruled by groups like the Taliban and no longer get the freedoms we enjoy now and they not us, will determine what is appropriate through a system we won't like much

I agree, but that doesn't mean people should be subjected to abuse and told to man the fuck up. Challenge their thoughts and beliefs. Debate them on the merits of their thoughts, and force them to justify or defend, but unprovoked insults strengthen no one and weaken the whole.

I'm trying to get people to realize to think for themslelves adn to understand the consequences of their actions and words.

No worries cap. I know your stance. And likewise, I want everyone to realize that actions and words have consequences. If they refuse to make concessions in their behavior, there are consequences. I don't like the idea of banning. I hate it. I'm a fervent supporter of freedom of speech and one's right to speak without fear of reprisal. More importantly, I love this site because of webby's refusal to lock it down with overly eager mods on every board killing the free exchange of thoughts, but when people are leaving because of one person abusing everyone else, you have to watch out for the general welfare of the whole.

[cap1015]

Guardian, have you ever read the book "Murder in Broad daylight" about Skidmore Missouri? It's a great read, shows how far a group of people had to go to rid the community of a person that threatened, harrassed, harmed the entire town. No amount of reporting to the police, filing complaints, litigation would work, so in the end they shot him, shot him on Main street, know what happened next? The authorities became almost manical in their attempts to identify and prosecute the "murderers'. Now with my lastest posts you would think, I would be the person saying "my God it was so wrong for them to take the law into their own hands, yada, yada"............Wrong, I understand what happened and my only surprise what how long it took for the town to resolve this in the way they did.

My point being I hate bullies, I hate anyone who harms someone smaller, weaker than them simply because they can. Because of this I have become an accomplished boxer, street fighter, I'm very skilled with fire arms, but I also have learned to work whatever system is in place to help protect those that can't protect themselves ( this includes computers skills, databases of information and connections with government employees, etc). I also hate that people feel the need to leave because of the actions of someone, and if you go back you can see long ago I fought some battles on here regarding some people bullying others. I just want people to understand that there is a difference between assualt and criminal behavour and someone telling you something you don't want to hear or don't like. Does that make sense?

I also began this post as I was offended that I was told my post was inappropriate...........not offended because that was their opinion, but offended because it was framed that it was "illegal, immoral, and overly completely unacceptable"..............My point was that was within their right to say they didnt' like it, it wasn't funny, it was inappropriate to them, they didn't like me, and so forth, but judge, jury and executioner of "allowed or not" was not their right or position.

I'm officially over debating, it's been fun, I've learned somethings and I'm pretty sure I'm misunderstood, which is okay, I'm used to it.............so in closing I'm going to try to show my humor and a little bit of my point of view...............
From the Great Movie ROADHOUSE this exchange is my mantra:
SWAYZE: All you have to do is be nice!
GREASY BARTENDER: Bullshit, that won’t work
SWAYZE: Trust me, just be nice, no matter what they do BE NICE.
GREASY BARTENDER: Well what if they call my momma a whore?
SWAYZE: Is she? Just Be nice!


Seacrest out................ .

[KRSTYSTLCLR]

Look Cap,
I did not frame my point of view in regards to a certain post as criminal. I will not debate this with you for the sake of having a peaceful forum. I will say that my reference of inappropriate comments of a sexual nature being a poor choice at the time was because there were, in the last 2 or 3 weeks, numerous comments references made to HD being banned. I personally chose not to answer that question of yours and left it for another member to answer. As of this morning, no one has answered your question. I did not make a complaint about you or your comment to anyone. I didn't run to the WM or foe you because I believe in many of the same Constitutional freedoms you do. Just the same as I have a right to choose not to answer your question and explain why. For the sake of having the forum return to a happy and fun place to comment and joke around, I welcome you to P.M. me personally to sort out any confusion or mis understandings. Like I said I believe in our personal freedoms as much as you, Guardian or anyone else. I can't speak about the issue with Parusia as that is his to deal with, but I hope that you will take me up on my offer to work out what is between us.

Sincerely,
KRSTY

[Guardian7347]

I'll look it up, it sounds like a good read.

Cap, I remember you. I know what you've done on here, and that's one reason I hold you in high regard. You honestly don't have to explain yourself to me my friend, we really ARE on the same page. As far as the difference between disliking what you hear and something genuinely wrong, I couldn't agree more, and I wouldn't make this an issue if it was something so minor as hurt feelings over a disagreeable fact. I've not said one word to you about your porn star posting. Neither has anyone else for that matter. There has been no outcry about it. If I thought it was inappropriate, do you think I would for one second hesitate to tell you so? lol Come on Cap! In my humble opinion, and it's just that, my opinion, I think you're doing the very same thing you initially got upset with her about. You made a comment in jest that she personally took offense to. She responded by telling you that was inappropriate, which is her right to say, and you in turn took offense to that. No one has judge, jury and executioner powers on here and you know this. I could tell you that you are banned and don't ever come back, but would that have any binding power? Not a chance. To be honest, I really don't understand why you let that bother you so much. My assumption is something else is weighing on your mind.

Take care of yourself Cap, I'll see you around.

[cap1015]

Look Cap,
I did not frame my point of view in regards to a certain post as criminal. I will not debate this with you for the sake of having a peaceful forum. I will say that my reference of inappropriate comments of a sexual nature being a poor choice at the time was because there were, in the last 2 or 3 weeks, numerous comments references made to HD being banned. I personally chose not to answer that question of yours and left it for another member to answer. As of this morning, no one has answered your question. I did not make a complaint about you or your comment to anyone. I didn't run to the WM or foe you because I believe in many of the same Constitutional freedoms you do. Just the same as I have a right to choose not to answer your question and explain why. For the sake of having the forum return to a happy and fun place to comment and joke around, I welcome you to P.M. me personally to sort out any confusion or mis understandings. Like I said I believe in our personal freedoms as much as you, Guardian or anyone else. I can't speak about the issue with Parusia as that is his to deal with, but I hope that you will take me up on my offer to work out what is between us.

Sincerely,
KRSTY

KRSTY/GUARDIAN.........first and foremost, I have enjoyed the debate and I have read every post you guys have written with appreciation for your responses and your point of view.......I have not now or before taken this personal, I think all along I just wanted to show what you two are saying in the last two posts you've made.....only I'm just not as smart or talented in writing it.........make sense?

KRSTY I have no issues or hurt feelings, i understand and appluad you for responding to my posts in the manner you did, you didn't flame or scream or yell.......you stated your points very well and in a very nice way.....same for Guardian............and I understand that some people, hell maybe everyone on this site for that matter, may not have liked or thought my post was funny. I'm okay with that, if you've seen me, you would know I'm used to rejection LOL!

KRSTY nothing to work out except that I hope you keep posting your thoughts, opinions and anything else you see fit.

I'm a firm believer that when you dish it out, be prepared to take it.......and I have my share of taking it, coming my way!

[Guardian7347]

I'm a firm believer that when you dish it out, be prepared to take it.......and I have my share of taking it, coming my way!

No you don't Cap. You're fine my friend. I too have enjoyed the debate. It remained intelligent and on point the whole way through. Relax man, and start making us laugh, would ya?

[SmileAreSexy]

* that doesn't work on me, faggot

Parousia you need to shut your mouth and give some respect especially since guardian fights for you to sit on your ass all day to bitch and argue with people on the internet.

[Chelsea Lynn]

* that doesn't work on me, faggot

Parousia you need to shut your mouth and give some respect especially since guardian fights for you to sit on your ass all day to bitch and argue with people on the internet.

It's true. If it weren't for "faggots" like Guardian and many others, Parousia wouldn't have the right to sit behind the safety of his computer monitor and troll on the interenetz!

[JeremyM]

you obviously have some weird sexually attraction towards me, jeremy. seriously man, it's creeping me out

Having problems thinking?

It is either sexual attraction or it is sexually attracted.

It is not sexually attraction like you typed. lolz

Hope everyone notices he didn't dispute anything I said about him.

[KRSTYSTLCLR]

Wwwhhheeeuuuwww. *takes deep breath*

[misha666]

all i can say is "wow"
so is malek at it again?
Guardian u are the hottest faggot i've ever seen. lol jkjk honey
so how u been hon and how was your new years?

[Nostalgic]

I agree, Cap wasn't out of line in the who would you rather thread.
The only people to break the unspoken rules and or laws was HD and Malek.

[Guardian7347]

all i can say is "wow"
so is malek at it again?
Guardian u are the hottest faggot i've ever seen. lol jkjk honey
so how u been hon and how was your new years?

Hello Misha! How have you been? Haven't heard much from you lately.

I would make a hot gay guy, but I just love the female body too much for that! lol

New Years was good. I was home with family for Christmas and New Years, so that was pretty cool. Had a good time, spent the holidays with my son and family, and now I'm back at it.

[Nostalgic]

Guardian, you're just a hot guy full stop

[JeremyM]

I agree, Cap wasn't out of line in the who would you rather thread.
The only people to break the unspoken rules and or laws was HD and Malek.

Then why did you type in another thread recently you think SMJ needs to be banned also?

Maybe you need to flirt with Green now, Nos, not Guardian. lolz

[Nostalgic]

I agree, Cap wasn't out of line in the who would you rather thread.
The only people to break the unspoken rules and or laws was HD and Malek.

Then why did you type in another thread recently you think SMJ needs to be banned also?

Maybe you need to flirt with Green now, Nos, not Guardian. lolz

SMJ supported and helped a sexual criminal.
I would rather she left than anyone else.

Guardian is hot, can't help myself. Greens not a bad looker either but guardians got the personality to go with his hotness.

[Guardian7347]

Guardian, you're just a hot guy full stop

You're pretty sexy yourself hon.

[Guardian7347]

I agree, Cap wasn't out of line in the who would you rather thread.
The only people to break the unspoken rules and or laws was HD and Malek.

They weren't the only ones hon. You know green was every bit as verbally abusive as Malek, he just spaced it out a little bit more to let things cool down before doing it some more. Look up the definition of verbal abuse, and you'll see a list of offenses committed by P. Did he have his moments where he wasn't bad? yeah, he did. But so did HD. So did Malek for that matter. How can we arbitrarily decide to shed ourselves of Malek because of the massive abuses and then green light the behavior of Parousia? Green was just Malek Light, and I'm tired of losing good people because no one wants to stop green from being a nasty hateful prick whenever the whim hits him. That's NOT acceptable, I don't care what medium it's in. People use this "it's the internet" excuse like that makes it ok for people to abuse and mistreat others. Could I use the excuse "Hey, it's public street?" if I seen a man punching a woman? No, so what's the difference?

[Nostalgic]

I agree he was verbally abusive at times but I never saw or heard of green being a sexual preditor like HD or stalking girls like malek had done.
They were the main reasons I was happy to see those two leave the forums.

[gargoylegoil]

tell you what i'll do guard: i'm bout to make a poll and ask dm if they want me to leave or not. tomorrow morning, before my walk i'll check the results. if there are more votes for yes, then i will peacefully bow out. if there are more votes for yes, then you put me on foe and let's be done of this, because i'm not changing for you or anyone else, asshole.

my word as a gentleman, i will abide

WAIT....read that to yourself Parousia....just saying

[gargoylegoil]

I'm so happy I have so much more to do than discuss something as insignificant as a internet forum. But I must admit, it is fun to read and see just how many of you "have no lives" and thrive on this battle. Good Luck to all of you

[cap1015]

I'm so happy I have so much more to do than discuss something as insignificant as a internet forum. But I must admit, it is fun to read and see just how many of you "have no lives" and thrive on this battle. Good Luck to all of you

What? I is confuzed over this post!

[Nostalgic]

I'm so happy I have so much more to do than discuss something as insignificant as a internet forum. But I must admit, it is fun to read and see just how many of you "have no lives" and thrive on this battle. Good Luck to all of you

Your sole purpose here is to point out spelling errors

[gargoylegoil]

I don't even care to do that anymore Nos

[Nostalgic]

I don't even care to do that anymore Nos

That's true but I couldn't help myself

[gargoylegoil]

I can take your teasing mommy....how's the boy??

[Nostalgic]

Great, Minus the fever from his teeth coming through again.
He's growing so fast.
How are you?

[gargoylegoil]

Well, have had some health issues, but healing up rather well. Started taking better care of myself, hence, the reason I'm not here as much. Sitting in front of a computer for 8 hours and then coming home to sit in front of my PC for 6 more, wasn't very good for my health.

[Nostalgic]

That's right, your lifestyle change.
You must feel you have more energy now. How long since the change?

[gargoylegoil]

Definitely more energetic. Just bought a pair of walking sneakers for my treadmill. Been about a week and a half since the change and things are improving already.

[jojo]

Did this topic come from my game thread?

I think this website is bias.

[KRSTYSTLCLR]

Yes it did.